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The Stratosphere Lounge

The Stratosphere Lounge Episode 352

A lot of insider insight on the Steve Crowder / Daily Wire mess from someone who’s been on both sides.

Here’s what I hope will be a bit of a calming influence on this issue from someone who has been on both sides of both sides.


44 replies on “The Stratosphere Lounge Episode 352”

I’m a Crowder fan but, he is a “Strange. Animal.” I subscribed to the Daily Wire even though they are. Apparently, “Never Trump'” and I’m not down! I subscribe to Bill Whittle.com because I believe that you have a voice that people need to hear. I’m not going anywhere!

You know what? I just upped my membership to sustaining this morning. after … well I’ve been a basic member since I think before the beginning … After listening to Bill and the undervalued deals he’s signed and appreciating so much of the content he’s made (especially the Firewalls, Apollo, the Cold War, and the Trifecta/Right Angles) and looking forward to his new series and I THINK it sounds like I missed one I need to go check out…

Hell I dropped the Blaze (no offense to the Blaze, I wish them well but I just haven’t read/watched in several years) … I can afford to pay Bill & Co a little more. I probably could have afforded it anyway.

He sounds like as lousy a negotiator and a stickler for completeness as I am. We’re about the same-ish age. We were raised in the same era. We clearly have a strong values overlap.

Here’s some encouragement for you. The bad deals with DW et al get you eyeballs. You cut your teeth, you prove yourself to be valuable.

Do that (and you have, I think), and Bill Whittle becomes more of a household name, you’ll be able to negotiate more than $50K for some new projects.

Phil, I did the same, went from “basic” for, well, like you, forever, to “sustaining” recently because I felt I was getting much more out of the content then I was paying in.
Another member posted in the forum how it’d be just the ticket if we could all get together as a membership and drop a 1 month Moneybomb on BW. Hundred bucks if we could afford it, 20 bucks as a minimum. One month, one day, just bomb the hell of of him. But I know, the economy sucks and everyone is just “scraping by”. But imagine the feeling knowing that on March 5th, 2023, 6000+ members dropped the MOAMB on Bill. It’d be a good payback. Plus, we’d get some kick ass content like the colonies or firewalls or animations, or all of it. And Imagine the actual smile on that guy’s face…

I missed the first 3rd of this TSL and grateful that Bill posted this so I could catch up. My forum question was axed because he had covered it all up front on TSL. All I really wanted to get across is that legal business negotiations between two parties (and I’m not one of them) are none of my business. Crowder, for whatever reason, felt it important to try to make it public.
Before all this hit the fan, I had somewhat negative feelings about Ben Shapiro – thought he was just annoyingly harpy, shrill, staccato, whatever I wanted to call it, just seemed like the message was right the the messenger was annoying. I had only good feelings about Jeremy Boering, only from the kind words Bill used to speak of Jeremy. Never met or even seen the guy until the Razor commercial came out, and only then I felt Jeremy B was ripping off the comedic styling of Mike from Dollar Shave Club. But watching Shapiro react on video to what Crowder did, and watching Jeremy Boering go line by line on the initial draft of a MOU to Crowder, explaining to me in detail what each line meant, well, it really changed my feelings about those two.
But Steven Crowder I felt was obnoxious, annoying, repetitive and his content was kind of thin, so after PJTV I stopped watching him. Oh, I’d catch a few minutes here and there over the years on YouTube, but nothing kept me along for the entire show. Yeah, he’s got a lot of subscribers for sure. But he’s a dick. He’s an ass. He’s a Jackass’s dick. He seemed to be very smart and fast witted, and probably is. But his style isn’t to my taste. Oh well. He does his thing…he nudges the ball forward in a way he feels he can. But the taping a private convo and releasing it, not good form dude. This was NOT the same as Project Veritas bringing down ACORN.
I have been paying to see Bill Whittle since PJTV days, every month, every year. I prefer the style, research, facts presented without the theatrics.
I most appreciate the effort which went into the “What we saw” efforts of Apollo and the Cold War, and America’s forgotten heros. And that was a combined effort of Bill Whittle AND Daily Wire. I learned so much from those works. I also really appreciate some of the Afterburners, like the story of the atom bomb, and the one on the Frankfurt school, but most appreciate the one called, I think, Straight from the Heart, or maybe it was called Tale of Two Americas. The Mike Schlitz portion is seared into my heart. So was Veterans Airlift Command, and the girls called Four More, and Welfare Square.
Crowder has eyeballs, lots of them.

We’re close enough to the same page on this as makes no practical difference.

I like Jeremy Boreing, Michael Knowles, Matt Walsh, Andrew Klavan and the rest and watch their video releases on YouTube on a regular basis. We even get a glimpse of Jeremy now and then in the Backstage episodes they post on YouTube.

I don’t care for Ben Shapiro but it’s nothing personal. I just can’t stand the way he talks. That rapid fire speech is just annoying. It’s not that my brain is too sluggish to capture it or that I have any trouble understanding it, it’s just irritating. My nephew talks like that and I’m constantly telling him to slow down or I’ll smack him for ticking me off. He has other uncles but I’m the one to avoid ticking off. The kid even looks like Shapiro’s little brother so it’s not his appearance or his message, it’s the way he speaks.

It’s not antisemitism either, I have beaucoup respect and high regard for Dennis Prager and he’s Jewish too.

I’m more sensitive to how people speak than most, I guess. There are manners of speech that just get on my nerves something fierce. Like Aussie Ocker or English Cockney for instance. There’s a show called “The Curse of Oak Island” that I catch every week. I’ve been wondering about that place all my life and when they put up a show about it they got me for the duration. But there’s this guy named Gary Drayton on there and I just seethe every time he speaks. I have nothing else against the man at all, I just can’t stand listening to him.

E ouns ike e as a mouf fuwl of mahbles.

Barry Hussein Obama was another one. That sibilant, hissing way he pronounces the letter ‘s’ sounds like a snake spitting to me. It didn’t help my image of him one bit when as POTUS he mispronounced “Marine Corps” as “Marine Corpse” all the time. Bastard. I do hold much against him besides his serpently mannerisms.

What Steven Crowder did was underhanded, dishonorable, completely unnecessary and wholly uncalled for.

Understand, I’m not taking The Daily Wire’s side. The Daily Wire is more than capable of defending itself adequately. They don’t need my help at all. They did nothing wrong that I can see. Now having had time to view the story from both sides and in considerable depth, plus the input of a third party in the person of Bill Whittle who has my respect — I don’t think their lack of malice or guile is in question.

Jeremy Boreing’s lack of judgement might be a bit tarnished and need a bit of buffing up. I don’t think he should have even tendered an offer to negotiate with Crowder. I have to wonder where in Jeremy’s mind he thought the risk of having Crowder on board was worth the price because Crowder gets himself in trouble. Not because he’s so damned brave and stands up to the Left blah, blah, blah, blah, blah ad nauseum …

Because he’s a cocky smartass. He’s an entertaining, funny cocky smartass but here’s a question I can’t seem to find an answer to …

Why is he leaving Blaze Media LLC in the first place? Crowder claims he’s not renewing his contract and I’m wondering if he was even offered the opportunity to renew? He was under a standard 4 year contract very similar to what TDW was kicking off negotiations with. If he had things he didn’t like about that contract all he had to do was bring them to the table with The Daily Wire and talk. Instead he pulled out his dick and started pissiing on them.

This situation really doesn’t make any sense.

I’m also not willing to take Crowder’s version of the situation that precipitated his departure from Blaze TV because … Guess what? He lied about and slandered his friends so I probably am not going to believe what he says anyway.

I’ve noticed there are people who are blindly loyal to Steven Crowder just like those who are blindly loyal to Donald Trump. In both cases those people refuse to even consider any constructive criticism of either of their objects of Hero Worship.

The people who worship Crowder don’t want to hear that the offering from DW was tentative, open, and subject to negotiation. Because their hero Crowder the Magnificent TOLD them it was a dirty bid by Big Con Inc. to ‘enslave him’ … With millions of dollars …

And so I see, even here on BWC where you’d expect more mature thinking to prevail, people making weird, tangential, torturous excuses for Crowder’s disreputable behavior.

And it IS disreputable behavior because of the way Crowder himself chose to go about it. He planned this for MONTHS, he suckered Jeremy into a phone conversation where he entrapped him knowing full well what he was doing and that he was going to go public with anything he could use for mud to throw.

And the worst of it is the damage to our side, the Left Wingnut Rags are crowing about this and having a field day. “Hey, look! Those Conservative people will stab their own friends in the back! Don’t listen to any of them, they’re traitors to their own side! Blah blah blah …”

And you’re absolutely right. This isn’t like Project Veritas taking down Acorn. This is like calling up your buddy to convince him to host a poker game at his house, then calling the cops to raid the game and pretending you’re all virtuous and would never play a filthy game of poker with those miscreants.

The thing that Steve Crowder didn’t seem to grasp is that this was essentially a starting point for a negotiation. We do this all the time. Between companies we call them Memorandum of Understanding. It is basically a document that says we are now going to get the suits involved and this is a FRAMEWORK of an agreement. Mark it up, cross stuff out, add items and negotiate.
My problem with Crowder is he not only just said no, but then he went flame thrower. Have a discussion understanding that this is not a benefactor situation like early PJ was, it is a business and DW needs to make a profit to survive.

The lesson (of which there are many here) is that..
You never, EVER, go full flame thrower!

You spelled that wrong, ‘retard’ is spelled r-e-t-a-r-d not f-l-a-m-e t-h-r-o-w-e-r.

Same result either way though, I suppose.

😉

The mistake that it appears DW/Jeremy seems to have made is that the first document to be passed along and signed by both parties should be a Mutual Non-Disclosure Agreement. We do this all of the time. If a deal falls through you don’t want people to know that there were even any discussions.

I am truly amazed that a MNDA was not done. Maybe it was and Jeremy didn’t want to put that out there as if he wasn’t going to sue Crowder it doesn’t matter that it was broken.
But that is usually the first document before getting into the details of any other possible relationship.

From my vantage point… Steven Crowder=Useful Ego [and I don’t believe that opinion is going to change]
When you can no longer tell friend from foe, you need to take a break and reassess. And yeah, I’m pointing at Crowder there.

Thank you so much Bill. Your perspective was the one I wanted to hear from most of all as I’ve personally wrestled with what has transpired. I have loved and supported you and Steven since I discovered you both on PJTV. I also support DW. You’ve helped me arrive at the conclusion that I will continue to support all three. Godspeed brother.

Bill,
As always, you give me something to think about. Your commentary is always insightful and I have no plans on leaving if you should happen to say something I cannot agree with. Hasn’t happened yet. Perhaps Steven is so colored by his longstanding feud with Big Tech that he sees that boogieman everywhere. And because he would lose control over his content. Can certainly see both sides here.

Bill,
I am never certain whether you read these comments or not, but I shall write this anyway. Your efforts are a boon to those who hear you. The fact that most of your content is made available to the public without fees is a testament to your character. In fact, your choice reminds me of my Dad who has failed at multiple businesses — in large part due tothe notion that he’d rather do charity work for customers than lose those customers. I have often disagreed with his tactic, because, without chains and iron bars, nobody can control the selfish behavior of others who will take one’s shirt AND pants in the deal. However, I think that my Dad is a happy man, and that is worth more than all of the world’s wealth.
Keep your chin up, old chap (is that how it’s said in Britain?). Those of us who can, will support your goals of educating the public about the right way to live with others in this world, which is bent upon evil and human destruction.

I Agree and after watching this episode of TSL what I come away with is more concern for Bill and his morale than any spat between Crowder and The Daily Wire. (TDW can easily take care of itself and if Crowder wants to be an ass and burn his bridges that’s to his detriment.)

I rarely get time on Thursday evenings to sit down, log in and watch TSL and I’m really sorry I missed this one live. I’d have had a thing or two to say to the people who were trying to manipulate Bill with the “if you do that you’re dead to me” pretext.

Because that’s what people like that are doing, they’re trying to manipulate Bill’s Free Speech with threats and it makes me wanna puke. It’s no surprise that people like that would ‘take Crowder’s side’ after Crowder betrayed friendships and repaid good will with lies and slander.

I want those people to vote Conservative and they’re likely going to do that no matter what side Bill Whittle takes on any particular issue. To try to wound Bill for his honesty proceeds from a place of moral vacuum.

Someone needs to sit Bill down and make him listen to Ricky Nelson’s “Garden Party” over and over again until he gets the message that ‘you can’t please everyone so you’ve got to please yourself’. Bill is open, honest and loyal, an admirable man. Being that way is how Bill ‘pleases himself’ in this context, by being true to his own nature. Anyone who can’t see and admire that are never deserving of anything more than being ignored.

That story behind “Garden Party” really should be mandatory reading/listening to those who put their opinions in public.
Right alongside “Don’t read the comments!”
Always like Ricky. He was in one of my all time favorite movies: “Rio Bravo”. The Duke, Dean Martin, Ricky Nelson, and 27 year old Angie Dickinson. Really good movie with its own backstory as to why they made it.
Did I mention a young Angie Dickinson? She’s in it, too!

Was it not Angie Dickenson who got Don Rickles in hot water for his comment to her on the Tonight Show, right after he kissed her hand?
Help me out members, am I conflating different actress and host? I certainly can’t forget the comment……
Yea, there’s a lot going on out there in the news right now. Having a tiny bit of fun on BWDC certainly helps a little.

Angie was an adjunct member of the Rat Pack and Rickles and Sinatra were friends, so while I don’t recall that story it certainly sounds true.

I think this is the source of that story.
https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2004/08/02/dont-call-me-sir
I think Angie would have taken Don’s insults the same way Frank did when Don surprised him and Johnny on the Tonight Show. (apparently CPO Sharkey shot on the next set as I saw a clip on YT a month or so ago where Johnny was mad at Don and they took a camera to the next studio and interrupted the taping of Sharkey)

I hate to keep putting out more comments, but no, I just have more to say so I’m gonna say it.

It occurs to me that part of the Alinsky strategy is to … well one of the rules is “hold your enemy to their own standards” … and the idea is to use their standards against them.

Using Meta and YouTube or “big tech” to put out content that fights the agenda it’s pushing … is part of out-Alinskying the Alinskyites. We need to do more of that (only in a moral, honest way)

Post as many comments as you like, you paid for this space the same as anyone else who’s here so speak your mind to your heart’s content. That’s one of the several reasons I’m here, I got tired of being censored, key-word blocked and forced to comply to someone else’s idea of being nice to everyone including those that don’t merit niceness.

As for the rest of your comment, I agree completely.

Where I work, we often don’t get raises. One year, raises were being given, and I got like a 1.5% raise. When I thanked my boss and was grateful, he was perplexed.

You see, most other people got 2-2.5% raises, and I was supposed to be upset and driven to do a “better” job (I was doing a fine job, by the way). Yes, it was supposed to be an “insult”.

Well for one thing, I had no idea other people were getting a tiny bit more than the tiny bit more I was getting. And when I found out, and I found out the motivation behind giving me “less” … my reaction was to laugh. It was hilarious to me.

I’ve always been grateful to be employed, even at my suckiest jobs.

If I’m supposed to do 192 shows and I only do 182 I only get $49 million instead of $50 … well so be it.

Daily Wire pays Meta to boost posts. In other words, to place their higher in peoples’ feeds. It’s part of being a … customer … of Meta. If Jeremy didn’t think it was worth the boost in visibility … Jeremy wouldn’t pay Meta jack.

Yeah, maybe ad money, too. Same argument.

Steven had a choice. He could have negotiated. He could have just turned it down. Or he could have taken it.

Those are choices. He chose “turn it down” ANNNNND … he chose to drag Daily Wire through the mud, and expose conservatives to at the very least gloatingly bad press from the MSM.

I’m a member here, and I’m a member at Daily Wire. And I intend to continue at both.

I’m hoping for every “I’ve been a member for 14 years but now you’re dead to me” there are two people like me.

One of the main reasons I stay with Bill is because Bill is probably the conservative person who is most like … me. Right down to him talking about this even though he knows he’ll probably lose members.

ONE of the main reasons. There are several others.

Bill … You’re a tool of Big Tech in exactly the same way I have white privilege and I’m still waiting for my White Privilege Check. The only subscription I can afford is here on BWC and I could really use that check about now. Especially as thanks to Joe Biden my grocery budget buys about 25% fewer groceries now.

The same goes for TDW, they’re not tools of Big Tech. TDW, YOU and all the people who rightfully support your message including me, are the nemesis of Big Tech. The idea that we are tools, especially those of us who are financially successful which I am not, is absurd.

This current circumstances with Big Tech is what Sun Tzu refers to in his 4th situation known as ‘contentious ground’. The enemy unwisely and unwillingly provides us ground to fight on and we would be stupid to cede that ground and run to less advantageous ground. That less advantageous ground is what Sun Tzu in his 1st situation refers to ‘dispersive ground’. Not to contend for contentious ground and to flee to lesser ground is always a mistake. Rumble is that lesser ground in this instance.

I’m not saying don’t use Rumble, I’m saying you cannot and should not abandon YouTube. Not if you want to win this battle and this war.

As for unkind remarks about your efforts both on behalf of Conservatism and your very reasonable explanation about how things work in your business … Ignore those bastards and don’t let them get to you.

You know as well as I do that not everyone who claims a Conservative ideology is automatically intelligent, educated and wise. There are many people here on your own website who subscribe to absurd ‘conspiracy theories’ that you yourself have debunked in the past. If the chemtrail crowd, the lizard people posse, the 9/11 was government done dopes, et.al., want to ride along and pay a membership fee — That’s fine. Let ’em. But don’t take their opinions to heart anymore than you would subscribe to the fallacy of global climate engineering and mind control coming out of the exhaust nozzles of high bypass turbofan engines.

Don’t take the word of idiots to heart. That way lies nothing but unmerited, useless grief.

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